ngyoung said:
That is what I understand.... It is there so scout that do nothing with the axles have a better chance of making it to the end of the track.
Stock axles w/ no alterations allowed
- Thread starter Skippy Kicky
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That is what I understand.... It is there so scout that do nothing with the axles have a better chance of making it to the end of the track.
I helped a scout like this a few years back, not because of the rule but due to a lack of time. I did just like pony said. I put the crimp marks on the top so the wheels only touched the bottom of the axles. I didnt mess with canting the rears but I was able to get the front to steer a bit. I had no lube I could use so I wiped on and dried off some regular Armorall to the wheel and axle. With correct weight placement and some steer, the little car actually won...I couldnt believe it hahaha
Skippy Kicky said:
That is quite possibly the dumbest rule I've ever heard. Basically what they're saying is hey kids, screw science, creativity and anything else you wanted to think of on how to make a car fast and just race a block of wood that you cut and paint. I thought the purpose of a race was for the fastest car to win. That being said, isn't the goal to make the "fastest" car possible?
I find it kind of ironic that the scouting organization tries to help kids learn different skills for life. Yet, when it comes to this part of scouting, they are tying their hands and NOT letting the scouts learn.
Pinewood Derbies are perfect for lessons in physics, with gravity, the effects of friction, etc. BUT don't use knowledge or anything to make your cars better.
What is the purpose?
Pinewood Derbies are perfect for lessons in physics, with gravity, the effects of friction, etc. BUT don't use knowledge or anything to make your cars better.
What is the purpose?
Come to think about it... if they are not allowed to do anything with their axles... they can learn A LOT about the affects of friction!!!
Yeah. Just have everyone pull a wheel off after they're done racing and compare it to an un used wheel. They will get to see how chewed up they get from the axles. When I was doing my scout work shop I had a wheel with plastic shaving hanging off the outer hub that I passed around to show how bad the axles mess up the wheels.
Mojo Racing said:
Right, NG... And after a few hundred races, the grooves will be worn in the hub so the friction will be less between the wheel and axle.
Oh wait... All of the rules for the cubs I have been working with say the car must be built within this school year.
I guess if they use axles and wheels three years ago...
Cant touch axles... still a stupid rule, no matter what
Oh wait... All of the rules for the cubs I have been working with say the car must be built within this school year.
I guess if they use axles and wheels three years ago...
Cant touch axles... still a stupid rule, no matter what
I am sure you have this covered, but a couple things that I would do. Especially since there is no mention of them being illegal. Since you can't remove friction point from the axle buy the revel axles as TRE mentioned. Secondly I would make sure the inside of the axle slots on the wheel were polished like crazy , Nouvice 2 and Red Rocket. If you can look to coat the body near the axle slot and the inner wheel hub as well as the cup between the axle head and wheel.
I know this is probably all very common sense for most racers/ builders, but a friendly reminder never hurts. I would probably spend as much time making sure I had my weighting just right and then the rest of the time on here pickin brains as much as I could.. there are some great folks on here. Btw I did not see anything about add ons... fenders that type of thing could be a real difference maker.Just sayin
I know this is probably all very common sense for most racers/ builders, but a friendly reminder never hurts. I would probably spend as much time making sure I had my weighting just right and then the rest of the time on here pickin brains as much as I could.. there are some great folks on here. Btw I did not see anything about add ons... fenders that type of thing could be a real difference maker.Just sayin
tmeyer said:
If the kits came with perfect wheels and axles and axle holes and weight pockets we would have no opportunity to teach the kids about friction reduction, weight placement and how to use the various tools. Isn't that the purpose of the derby anyways?
So, I like that the axles need work but then let the kids rework the darn things so they get to use the tools and see how to reduce friction and get a little shop time with ol' Ma or Pa!
Can you countersink the front face of the wheel hub so the burrs under the nail head don't make contact and the wheel rides on the outer edge of the head? Can you smooth the edge of the burr under the head so it at least doesn't have a knife edge on it? Maybe even file the back edge of the burr at a slight taper and smooth it out. Taper it from back to front so as the wheel spins clockwise down the track the face of the hub is riding on the smooth taper of the burr. The more I think of ideas the funner it sounds to play with that burr slightly and do other tiny things and blow them all away.
Seems your Pack is more interested in having all of the cars equal rather than allowing the adults to work with and teach their kids how to build a car. I'm thinking the founder of the derby would frown on those rules.
** I say, have some of the scouts give a little presentation to your coordinator on how they're missing out on the opportunities that the derby build presents for them. They could even work the presentation into a Communicator badge or Communications belt loop.
I'd make sure that the part that says "The axles may not be altered, polished and lubricated" isn't missing a few words. To me, it's an awkward sentence, and seems like a mistake. If the rule's intent is to not polish or lubricate the axles, it would say "...polished OR lubricated". Instead, it says "and". Maybe they left out "They may be...". Further down the list, the rules state that dry lubrication is allowed for wheels and axles, which supports my typo theory. I think you need to find out from the rule writers if they made a typo, or left out a few words. It would be awful to get to the race with unpolished axles with burrs and crimps, and find out that everyone else polished theirs.
I don't think that it's just stupidity. We can't assume scout leaders know much about what makes a car fast. They should. But it's not required by any means.
What's sad is the Box Stock division has shown us we can make a car with stock wheels and axles fast! You don't even need fancy tools to GROOVE your axles. I started with a needle nose pliers lightly gripping the axle where I wanted the groove and spinning it in my $10 Harbor Freight hand drill. I got an initial groove with that, then followed it up with the file on my leatherman multi tool. Wheel prep is also low tech.
I "tuned" it on a 3' table with a bump in the middle.
That's why I called my Box Stock Ghetto Superstar.
What's sad is the Box Stock division has shown us we can make a car with stock wheels and axles fast! You don't even need fancy tools to GROOVE your axles. I started with a needle nose pliers lightly gripping the axle where I wanted the groove and spinning it in my $10 Harbor Freight hand drill. I got an initial groove with that, then followed it up with the file on my leatherman multi tool. Wheel prep is also low tech.
I "tuned" it on a 3' table with a bump in the middle.
That's why I called my Box Stock Ghetto Superstar.
- Nov 24, 2011
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