Four wheels must touch

[Dintlow]

I'm helping my son build his first PWD car and the rules state "The car can not be designed to allow for any thing less than four points of contact with the track". We would like to build a car that rides the rail. Is it possible to do this with four wheels and if so, do we cant both wheels in the same direction?
Would it be faster to have the fourth wheel barely touching the track and let the other wheels carry the weight of the car?

 

[IAE Racing]

I'll try to help out here, but I have never done this. I believe those that have done this successfully will say "Just touch on your lifted front.

 

[OPARENNEN]

Best to just get a pre-drilled block from DD4H.
I got one to run sub 3 for two grandsons
You still get to run the rail, and all 4 wheels touch w/o any adjusting of any of the front wheels.
It will take you hours to try to do it yourself, and you probably won't succeed.
When you receive it, then your son can still carve,or decorate it himself.
Still requires great care on the axles and wheel bores.

 

[Dintlow]

There is a rule about using the BSA block. "Only the block of wood from the official BSA kits shall be used. No pre cut store or internet purchased body will be permitted."

 

[Rocket car]

It is possible, but the front wheels have to be drilled perfectly. Very hard to do.

 

[Dintlow]

This is our first pinewood derby build so "very hard to do" is something we want to avoid. Maybe we should just stick to straight axles.

 

[bracketracer]

OK, based on the rule you posted, call DD4H on the phone and order the body. You will need to shape it a little to finish it. That way you didn't buy a pre cut body and you didn't purchase it over the internet. No problem!

Do your rules mention anything about bending an axle, canting the axles, or that the wheels must be installed "straight up"?

My son's Pack doesn't allow canting and the wheels must be installed vertically, but we only need to run three down. I set the rears one degree canted, bent the DFW two degrees and turned the bend forward so it had some steer but didn't tilt the wheel and slightly lifted the NDFW. He got second in Tiger, eighth fastest overall in a car modeled after a NASCAR stock car. It was huge. This year after seeing my league racing cars he believes in "thin to win!" so he's designing a much smaller car. With everything we've learned on this site, I am going to be embarrassed if he doesn't do better! lol!

 

[Obsessedderbydad]

Wow, I cant believe the rules some packs have. What's sad is the people that make these rules think it's creating an even playing field and it's fair. First off, getting all 4 to touch is hard enough, especially with a pre-drilled (slotted) block they give you. If you have purchased the "block", then you're already ahead. I've never tried it with 4 on the floor, but I believe if you cant the rear and just leave the front straight, it'll take a lot of tuning, but it'll be possible. Just have to tune both front wheels instead of just the DFW.

 

[Kinser Racing]

Buy the "SILVER BULLET" from DerbyDad4Hire (John).

 

[txchemist]

I got the pack rules changed to basically SS rules some years ago.
Kids started coming over this year for help and brought the "NEW" pack rules with them. They came from the Elementary school that put them together over 30 years ago to stop my kids from winning all the races. 4 on the floor was the big deal plus using all the parts passed out in the Kit. I called the Cub-master (new- uninformed) and went over why that was not a good set of rules. He had let a new Den mother go out and come up with the rules. He said OK, just you and me will do check in and we will not disqualify any cars for these issues, but we better wait until next year to officially change the rules back and he is passing that along to all the parents-translation- forget the rules this year.

I have a few levels of help I give out to kids working with a parent on a car.

First years- 4 on the floor ( but if they start with lots of time and show a big interest, I cant positive on back and negative on front. using silver bullet ,and teach them polish etc. and use DD4H graphite process.
Bear- 3-wheeler oil
Webelos- 3 wheeler Rail R oil tuned

anyone shows up in the last few days gets four on the floor no canting and it might be a 3 wheeler by random outcome, but no tuning and I tell them where to go get some Hob-E-Lube
To me this is fair because any boy puts out even a tiny bit of effort will have a car that runs an OK time, but the boy who wants to learn and can spend the time will get more instruction. So far this year, one boy has come over and spent over 10 hours working on his car. Even though it is 4 on the floor graphite, with no tuning, it is running faster than the last two years winners who were Webelos running oil

NOTE: you do not have to mess around for hours trying to get 4 to touch- NO CUB can pound nails into the slots and hit 4 on the floor. Even with a drill press, one wheel might still be predominant. I checked the drift of the super fast "4 on the floor" and found it was drifting the wrong direction for a good rail car, but the positive cant on both front wheels allows the lifted wheel to rail run smoothly just touching on the bottom of the lip to the side of the rail while the lower wheel just rolls on the outer rim on the bottom of the track. The car goes smoothly without wobble down the track with all 4 wheels turning.

 

[OPARENNEN]

There is a rule about using the BSA block. "Only the block of wood from the official BSA kits shall be used. No pre cut store or internet purchased body will be permitted."

This a rule that almost everyone ignores. Many may chastise me on this, but there is hardly a winner across the nation that does not ignore this rule. However, if you feel strongly, just send John a BSA block and have him drill it for you. In fact, while he has it, have him hollow out the body in his X format.