Need advice on COM of 0.5" (or less) using puma weights

Feb 3, 2015
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My sons are building ladder style cars with balsa bottoms, monokote wrap and carbon sticker tops. This year to try something new they are using Puma weights. It seems it would be possible to get the COM as low -- or even lower -- than 0.5 inches, which begs the question whether that is advisable?

Their cars are standard axle distances, but they did cut some off the back and glue to the front to get the rear wheels as close to the back as possible. They have 10 tungsten cubes behind the axle and need to place 3 more to hit 5 oz, per the picture. They could put those weights just about anywhere, including asymmetrically to one side.

With the weights just in front of the rear axle, the COM is less than the radius of the Puma weights, or less than 0.5 inches, and the weight on the DFW is 0.452 oz.

If they put the 3 cubes in the pocket in front of the axles but more forward in that pocket, as shown in the picture, the weight on the DFW increases to 0.451 oz.

If they put the 3 cubes in the next forward pocket (just visible under the carbon sticker) the weight on the DFW would increase to 0.563 oz.

They do NOT have access to a track to tune. The first run down one will be their first heat. Their pack uses an aluminum track. The question is what COM to go for? Note that the rear axles have been drilled at 2.5 degrees and so they will use straight rear axles. Post drilling they moved away from the body on both forward and rear rolls, though they've yet to install the actual axles and wheels for additional testing. But that testing will be done on a flat surface or homemade ramp, not an actual track.

They've historically done fairly well -- e.g., winning their ranks and placing in the pack -- but thy've never done better than 2nd, so there is some incentive to consider a more aggressive COM in search of faster times, but perhaps that is inadvisable?

Any counsel on COM would be greatly appreciated!

 
A 1/2" com is pretty aggressive for a scout car. 3/4" would give you more stability. With the backs drilled at a 2.5 degree cant, you will need about 5-7" of steer over 4' to be stable. I would go 7" to be safe. The lower the com the more steer needed to keep it from wiggling.

P.s. The more aggressive com does not = speed it's more in the prep of the wheels.
smile
 
I believe that you'd be best served to remove some or all of the back row of cubes and put them in front of the rear axle. Your weight will still be dense (less force required to rotate the car from the hill to the flat), but your CoM will be closer to 3/4" — which will make your car less likely to pop a wheelie.
 
I think I would try to get to at least 1/2" probably closer to 3/4". Not having a way to test I wouldn't feel comfortable going that extreme for my scouts car. You could place one of the cubes right behind your DFW. Like Rocket said, extreme COM is not going to give you a big speed jump.
 
I would recommend in the future if you spend any more money on PWD supplies, make it the "Silver Bullet". It will give you the best bang for your buck for building fast cars.

The SB and supplied pin work really good to also square your drill press table to the spindle. Just chuck the pin and set the block against it on the table to check for any daylight.

Even if the table is a little off, having a machined square SB will mirror any deviation to the opposite hole. The axles will still be parallel to each other.
 
I guess because that's what they've always done. Partially based on our old way of using the axle bending tool -- which had 1.5 and 2.5 degree options -- though with a drill press and straight axles, anything is possible. Perhaps next year they should try 3 degrees?
 
Ah, the axle bender. That explains it. There's lots of options on how much cant to put on the rears. 2.9, 3, etc... Just wondered why 2.5 was your number. Only thing I use that axle bender for anymore is a weight on the rear of the car when I check my drill job.