Rules Help

[LightninBoy]

The best scout racing rules in the nation are right here ...

http://www.northernstarbsa.org/Forms/Activities/PinewoodDerbyRules.pdf

And enforceability is a key tenet. With a few exceptions, these rules do a good job of keeping to rules that can be enforced.

 

[B_Regal Racing]

Its been said before, but the concept of a cub race is to build a car with your son. The scouts are giving you both an opportunity to pull out the jack-hammer and chain saw to create a physics defying masterpiece - something most kids can not pass up. I know there are kids who do not understand the concept of "bending the rules to win" and why they lost; its hard to explain that to an 8yr old. We went to MA knowing we were not going to win, but that's OK. Don't get me wrong - I'm not suggesting those that beat us were cheating. It has nothing to do with whether we won or lost. We built, we attended, we had a blast, and we move on.

 

[microbrush]

The best scout racing rules in the nation are right here ...

http://www.northernstarbsa.org/Forms/Activities/PinewoodDerbyRules.pdf

And enforceability is a key tenet. With a few exceptions, these rules do a good job of keeping to rules that can be enforced.

I like the NSC rules as well. It is also great that the rules include tips that would help you. If only more people would read the rules they may even learn a tip or two.

 

[Vitamin K]

The best scout racing rules in the nation are right here ...

http://www.northernstarbsa.org/Forms/Activities/PinewoodDerbyRules.pdf

And enforceability is a key tenet. With a few exceptions, these rules do a good job of keeping to rules that can be enforced.

Been studying the NSC rules as I make suggestions for a reworking of our district's rules.

I think I might be able to sway them on oil and wheelbase restrictions...not sure about axles...even though I agree that it is impossible to enforce aftermarket axles.

If we did relax axle regs, I might consider buying a quantity of Awana pins and distributing them to our Pack, free of charge. Because axle prep sucks. /images/boards/smilies/frown.gif

 

[BulldogRacing]

I went to most pack races in our district this year because I had a kid or 2 who asked me to help. All rules were different and I was asked to start up our district race again as it has not happened the last 5 years. Here are the rules i wrote useing NPWDRL as a template but I tried to take out anything that might confuse some.

Grants Pass Drags.
Check in begins at 3:30 pm. Racing begins at 5pm.

Questions please call Mike Quist at 541 450 1976

There will be Trophies in all cub levels plus a overall champions race for the best of the best!

We will also be running an open class for siblings, parents, and friends which will also have trophies for the top 3 cars!

This race will be held on a Best track brand all aluminum pine wood derby track as well as a top of the line champ timer. All cubs are encouraged to bring a car to race, you can use the car from pack races or build a new one.

Order of races will be Tigers, Wolves, Bears, Webelos, Open class.

Our rules for all classes are as follows.

Car Body

Wheel Base : Any as long as wheels do not exceed the 7″ total length requirement
Total Car Height : Not to exceed 5″ inches…
Total Car Length : Not to exceed 7″ inches…
Total Car Width : Not to exceed 2-3/4″ inches…
Total Car Weight : Not to exceed 5.0 ounces
After cars are checked in they may only be handled by race officials. No re-lubricating. Damaged cars will have 5 min to make repairs.
Axles
.Axles may be polished
. Axles must have a nail head
Wheels
.4 Axles & Wheels must be installed to the side of the car body directly across from one another
. Only official BSA wheels are approved including colored ones.
. Wheels May be lathed, polished and/or sanded to true the edge of tread, surface and circumference as long as the wheel width remains at least 5/16“ wide at the tread, in other words no razor wheels.
. Lettering must remain visible on the inside and outside of the wheel.
Lubrication Graphite, tefflon, krytox, and other lubricants are allowed as long as they are not dripping on the track and effecting other cars.
The following Modifications are not allowed
a. Starting or finish line devices
b. Electronic or lighting devices
c. Glass or extremely fragile parts
d. Paint that is wet, smudges or extremely sticky
e. Bearings and/or Bushings
f. Sharp objects, sandpaper or abrasives on the bottom of car (We do not want any damage to the rubber stopping pads)
g. Axles and/or wheels attached to any device that mechanically or alters rotation and spin
h. Any part of the car to go beyond the starting peg (see photo below)
j. Propellants

 

[LightninBoy]

The best scout racing rules in the nation are right here ...

http://www.northernstarbsa.org/Forms/Activities/PinewoodDerbyRules.pdf

And enforceability is a key tenet. With a few exceptions, these rules do a good job of keeping to rules that can be enforced.

I like the NSC rules as well. It is also great that the rules include tips that would help you. If only more people would read the rules they may even learn a tip or two.

To anyone thinking of incorporating tips into their PWD rules, one danger with adding tips to rules is that the tips often get misinterpreted as rules. That's why the 2015 NSC rules were updated to clearly distinguish the tips and other explanatory text from the actual rules.

 

[LightninBoy]

Good work Bulldog. Couple points in line ...

I went to most pack races in our district this year because I had a kid or 2 who asked me to help. All rules were different and I was asked to start up our district race again as it has not happened the last 5 years. Here are the rules i wrote useing NPWDRL as a template but I tried to take out anything that might confuse some.

Grants Pass Drags.
Check in begins at 3:30 pm. Racing begins at 5pm.

Questions please call Mike Quist at 541 450 1976

There will be Trophies in all cub levels plus a overall champions race for the best of the best!

We will also be running an open class for siblings, parents, and friends which will also have trophies for the top 3 cars!

This race will be held on a Best track brand all aluminum pine wood derby track as well as a top of the line champ timer. All cubs are encouraged to bring a car to race, you can use the car from pack races or build a new one.

Order of races will be Tigers, Wolves, Bears, Webelos, Open class.

Our rules for all classes are as follows.

Car Body

Wheel Base : Any as long as wheels do not exceed the 7″ total length requirement
Total Car Height : Not to exceed 5″ inches…
Total Car Length : Not to exceed 7″ inches…
Total Car Width : Not to exceed 2-3/4″ inches…
Total Car Weight : Not to exceed 5.0 ounces
After cars are checked in they may only be handled by race officials. No re-lubricating. Damaged cars will have 5 min to make repairs.
Axles
.Axles may be polished

I generally try to avoid positive rules. Unless you are trying to explicitly limit axle modifications to polishing (no grooving, bending, etc.) , then you can just remove that "polish" rule as it will just cause confusion.

Wheels
.4 Axles & Wheels must be installed to the side of the car body directly across from one another

Consider "at least 4 axles and wheels". Kids will want to build tanks and trucks that have more than 4 wheels.

. Only official BSA wheels are approved including colored ones.
. Wheels May be lathed, polished and/or sanded to true the edge of tread, surface and circumference as long as the wheel width remains at least 5/16“ wide at the tread, in other words no razor wheels.

Again, the positive phrasing could be reasonably interpreted that these are the only wheel modifications allowed. Can the bores be polished? Can the inner hub be tapered? Can the outer hub step be removed? Can the wheel be lightened by removing inside material? With a literal reading, the answer to all of these would be "no".

Also consider adding a maximum wheel cant angle to make sure that any lifted wheel will still contact the guiderail and prevent a wiggling car from coming off the rail and contacting another car.

 

[Crash Enburn]

BulldogRacing][/b]
off topic, how do I wrap quote tags around a text from a post and have it also say who originally posted the text?

You can also type in (remove the spaces, I'm just adding them so as to be able to display)
"[ quote=InsertRacerNameHere ] Then cut and paste any text. And then close the quote: [ /quote ]"

Which will generate:

InsertRacerNameHere[/i]] Then cut and paste any text. And then close the quote:

This is useful if you are quoting from several entries in a thread.

 

[ngyoung]

Most scout derbies they don't do much at inspection beyond what you experienced. Even my son's district derby I am sure I could get away with the lightest wide wheels offered with markings if we wanted to ignore the posted rules.

In most cases if you want to have it change you will need to offer to help run the event.

I agree if someone looks closely they could see the wheels were worked on. I know when my boy checked in. They put the checked the car length, width, spacing for wheel base, and weight. They also looked to see if it had all 4 on the floor. They didn't really look at the wheels. Check to see if the axles were magnetic. They also put the cars on their side (basically on two of the wheels) to weight them, which was odd.

What are MA rules? Is there a link to MA rules?

Couldn't they easily say the winners cars will have the wheels pulled and the weight has to be x grams? I personally feel getting the boy to learn about reducing friction is a large part of the process. So we talk about polishing the axles, etc...

 

[561 racing]

For our district race they have adopted MA rules, thus our pack follows the same. I have to really dial the kids back in that race just so others don't get discouraged.

 

[BulldogRacing]

Thanks Lightnin Boy!