What qualifies as "altering a wheel."

DuckOfAllTrades

DuckOfAllTrades

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Jan 25, 2019
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Hey everyone.

First thanks for your great help. Certainly appreciated! I don't want to spam the board, but had another question. I've searched for the answer on the forum, and can't seem to find what I'm looking for.

As some may know, I was looking to round the wheel off on my sons car using the pro wheel shaver.

In looking over the strict rules, I noticed this.

"Wheels may not be altered in any way."

Does this mean NOTHING can be done to the wheel? I'm not looking for a huge change, or anything. I just want wheels that are rounded off. I have been thinking about going ahead and ordering a lightly lathed wheel. But now I'm hesitant.

On one hand, I don't believe this is altering the wheel. It really changes nothing, the wheel is intact. Just shaves a little off so it's true. No different than deburring the axles and shinning them up, which is stated you can do.

On the other hand, this maybe a clear indication we can't use lightly lathed wheels.

Thanks in advance for your opinion and help!
 
Also, meant to add. If I can't use these wheels, how do I choose the BEST stock wheels to use. I've got a number of sets mold matched, just not sure where to start to pick the best ones.
 
I'd think the intent of the rule would be to stop the use of wheels that have been lathed, or wheels that have the hubs modified meaning significant reshaping type modifications. I'd bet that they are trying to make people use the wheels in out of the box form with just minor sanding and polishing allowed to smooth (like what can be done to the axles).
 
The more I think on it, I think you guys are right. It's not necessarily a bad thing. Kind of levels the field for people that can't afford altered wheels. Makes everything even.
 
KyleBCostco said:
We did that this year in our scout race, basically box stock rules. The idea was to keep the costs down and make it competitive for everyone.
Click to expand...
That's really not a bad thing when you think about it! Plus, it helps people like me who DON'T have the money, but spend it anyway because they get obsessed with Pinewood Derby Season.
 
Going on a tangent, I wish there were ONE set of rules for District and all packs under that district. Last year, I won our pack's adult derby. But when I took my car to the District championships, it failed because it had to have four on the floor . I heartbreakingly tore apart the car I spent HOURS tuning til it was perfect and forced four wheels to touch in the 10 minutes I had before the race started. It was SO hard to do and the car was much slower. Stupid on me to NOT get the rules before hand, to assumed they would be the same. You live, you learn. This year I will be prepared with TWO cars. I think I got lucky last year winning, but if I'm able to win again, I'll be prepared.
 
Our pack follows the district rules. It makes no sense not to. I did hear rumor that some years in the past that this wasn't the case in our pack though. Guys would build a different scout car for district and pack to get around the issue.

Your districts has a race for the adults? Our pack does but not the district.

Scott
 
Yes, I didn't know that til last year, I assumed pack was it until I was invited. I should restate that, Adult/sibling race. Anyone can enter. There was no real significance at the district level placed on the adult race. It wasn't stressed at all, and not many people were in it. No significance or recognition for winning. Only the winner got a trophy, wasn't stressed as important at all compared to the scout races, which is how it should be!

I finished second at district with my make shift speeder. (The one in my profile picture)
 
I should also note the adult/sibling class has NO rules. It officially states:

This is essentially a “no holds barred, cage match, loser leave town.”

You can basically by a car on Ebay and participate. Nothing in the rules against it! Needless to say, I'm NOT doing that, but could face others doing it.
 
DuckoofallTrades said:
Also, meant to add. If I can't use these wheels, how do I choose the BEST stock wheels to use. I've got a number of sets mold matched, just not sure where to start to pick the best ones.
Click to expand...

The most "scientific" way is to build or buy a runout gauge. With an inexpensive dial indicator, some wood, and a pin gauge or two you (or your scout) can find the best wheels easily.

The spin test is the other method - get a nicely prepped axle, slip the wheel on, and give it a spin. Feel the vibrations, watch the wobble, and sort out the wheels with the least of each. The smoothest running wheels tend to be the roundest ones.
 
DuckoofallTrades said:
I should also note the adult/sibling class has NO rules. It officially states:

This is essentially a “no holds barred, cage match, loser leave town.”

You can basically by a car on Ebay and participate. Nothing in the rules against it! Needless to say, I'm NOT doing that, but could face others doing it.
Click to expand...

If there are NO rules, then most ebay cars will lose anyhow, because the winning cars will have ducted fans, electric motors, CO2, or some other propulsion.
 
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ironband said:
The most "scientific" way is to build or buy a runout gauge. With an inexpensive dial indicator, some wood, and a pin gauge or two you (or your scout) can find the best wheels easily.

The spin test is the other method - get a nicely prepped axle, slip the wheel on, and give it a spin. Feel the vibrations, watch the wobble, and sort out the wheels with the least of each. The smoothest running wheels tend to be the roundest ones.
Click to expand...
Thanks so much for the advice! That might be the route I go. Though I have NO idea what those tools are or how to use them to tell, ha ha. I'll do some research and see if I can figure it out.
 
thank you ironband. DuckoofallTrades here are the items I ordered from amazon in reference to the aforementioned derbytalk thread on measuring wheel runout ... obviously you don't need to order the same items. I ordered other size pin Gages as well. Despite being home made the setup works very well.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01JYCVHLK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006JD9SU/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o07__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004TH9GVO/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
DuckoofallTrades said:
Going on a tangent, I wish there were ONE set of rules for District and all packs under that district. Last year, I won our pack's adult derby. But when I took my car to the District championships, it failed because it had to have four on the floor . I heartbreakingly tore apart the car I spent HOURS tuning til it was perfect and forced four wheels to touch in the 10 minutes I had before the race started. It was SO hard to do and the car was much slower. Stupid on me to NOT get the rules before hand, to assumed they would be the same. You live, you learn. This year I will be prepared with TWO cars. I think I got lucky last year winning, but if I'm able to win again, I'll be prepared.
Click to expand...

Also annoyed by this. The BSA should come out with a uniform set of rules. In our district, we were sent to the local scout shop to get our starter blocks. At the shop, they sold dozens of items that were specifically designed to do things that were against the rules.
 
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