2015 Northern Star Council race today.

If anyone in our Pack was cheating, they stunk at it since I know a legal car won. lol

I looked over the cars as I staged them, there was only one that I thought was trying something funny but he was a mid-pack runner so we didn't worry about it.
 
bracketracer said:
If anyone in our Pack was cheating, they stunk at it since I know a legal car won. lol

I looked over the cars as I staged them, there was only one that I thought was trying something funny but he was a mid-pack runner so we didn't worry about it.
I found 1 car with mid America wheels, I questioned him"you know these are lightened right? I got a ya so what" I explained those aren't legal..he just up and left.
 
microbrush said:
Congratulations! Also, congratulations to all the others who were there. It would have been nice to meet any of you. Maybe next year we can have a booth or all wear pink shirts or something.

We were there as well. I think that the track was longer or something was different. Warren runs our pack race (With the same track I am guessing, but now am confused as there were two yesterday) and our times were faster at the pack race than yesterday. Fact is we made quite a few modifications and were able to gain .055 on their 42 foot test track and our times were slower on the track yesterday then at the pack race. Also, no car that I saw yesterday was able to break 3.70, when last year a couple did. I think overall people were faster? (as more seem to be finding this site). Was the track longer? (some cars were smashing into the end of the stop section-never have seen that before) or it was harder to set up at Basecamp? Anyone know any specifics about the track?

Or is it just the variances in the angle of the hill that makes such a difference in times?

This was our first year there. If you made it last year and took seventh with all stock parts you are VERY impressive!!!! Your car had to be faster this year.
we matched the hill on both tracks I believe that was the culpret, the second track was lowered to match the first, I voted to raise the second..got over ruled.lol its good to change it up I guess.
 
I saw the front ends of some Webelos I cars getting light off the transition. Is that due to the angle or were they just running aggressive COM's.
 
twistediron said:
]I found 1 car with mid America wheels, I questioned him"you know these are lightened right? I got a ya so what" I explained those aren't legal..he just up and left.

Classy!
 
You're kidding. He left and his boy didn't even get to race? How does the kid explain that Grandma and Grandpa and his friends who were excited to hear how he did.

For this Council we ran aftermarket wheels and axles for the first time. We also had our stock wheel/axle combos already pre-marked and reprepped in a box sitting in the truck. Tuning board also in case we had to swap them and re-adjust steer. I was nervous about an inspector's caliper being different than the one used to machine the wheels.
Teaching my boy the Be Prepared thing and all.
 
HurriCrane Racing said:
There is so much cheating in Scout PWD it would make a Nascar guy blush!!!

I was talking to the District Chairman in my scout district tonight about proposing to open the rules about the axles on the cars. He couldn't understand why I wanted to do that. When I explained that it was because you cant see whether they are grooved or not, he didn't grasp it. He said, "They are required to use the axles from the kits." I asked him how he knows they axles are from the kits, and unmodified. When he replied that there is a mark on the head, I reverted back to the ol' axle straightening tool concept to taper the head. I said "When you hit that nail with a hammer to taper the head, that makes the mark unreadable... Then what?"

He just looked at me... Then he said, "Well, this is how we have always done it, and the kids don't generally cheat when making their cars." I just looked at him and said, "You are right... The dads do."

Jeez... Why are people so AGAINST trying to make the kids have faster cars. The kids want the faster cars... let them have them.
 
Vitamin K said:
What line of work gives you this insight into the psyche of cheaters?

We all come across people like this. They talk fast and often about things not related to the issue at hand just to keep you distracted. Could be a car salesman asking you about your kids during a test drive of their used car. The carpet installer that scratched up your walls and is telling you how awesome the new carpet looks while your doing a final inspection before they leave. Or, the autobody shop telling you how they don't see many cars like yours in there in such good shape, hoping that as you walk around it you don't notice the crappy job they did of wetsanding and polishing the paint behind the door handles.

I wonder now, after hearing what Twisted came across, how many cars were illegal at our District race. One inspector began shoving one of those common store bought gap gauges between our wheels and body. We had them set at .015". I asked her not to push too hard or she would mess up the car. She told me they had to meet the rules, except, our NSC rules don't specify a gap requirement. She handed it back to my boy and told to fix them if he needed to before weighing it in. She didn't even know the rules. I do appreciate the time they volunteer and even a situation like we had with her can be a teaching moment for the boy.
 
Jeez... Why are people so AGAINST trying to make the kids have faster cars. The kids want the faster cars... let them have them. [/QUOTE said:
do it for the Kids!
cool
 
BulldogRacing said:
Jeez... Why are people so AGAINST trying to make the kids have faster cars. The kids want the faster cars... let them have them. [/QUOTE said:
do it for the Kids!
cool

Well, I am on the rules committee now, and we are going to bring all of the packs together to go over them and vote on the rules. Hopefully we will have a total revamp of the stock / stickler rules.

ok
 
twistediron said:
microbrush said:
Or is it just the variances in the angle of the hill that makes such a difference in times?

This was our first year there.
we matched the hill on both tracks I believe that was the culpret, the second track was lowered to match the first, I voted to raise the second..got over ruled.lol its good to change it up I guess.

I think that both tracks were very similar in times as my kids raced on different tracks. You guys did a great job in matching them up. I think my wolf's car was a smidge faster as my Webelo II did not want to tune his as it was faster from before as we made a few adjustments. It was his choice. Bothered me then and now even more as we were sooooo close to a 5th place.

Sorry that you had to argue with other people. You did look exhausted when we came by for the Webelo II. But you do have skills to be able to tell car weight in grams by holding it in your hand
smile
.

Thank you for your help in this race and to all of the others. We love having the great track and sound effects at our pack race. It is always awesome!
 
davet said:
I saw the front ends of some Webelos I cars getting light off the transition. Is that due to the angle or were they just running aggressive COM's.
I'm guessing aggressive com&wheel weights. Only a couple had wheel weights
 
davet said:
Vitamin K said:
What line of work gives you this insight into the psyche of cheaters?

We all come across people like this. They talk fast and often about things not related to the issue at hand just to keep you distracted. Could be a car salesman asking you about your kids during a test drive of their used car. The carpet installer that scratched up your walls and is telling you how awesome the new carpet looks while your doing a final inspection before they leave. Or, the autobody shop telling you how they don't see many cars like yours in there in such good shape, hoping that as you walk around it you don't notice the crappy job they did of wetsanding and polishing the paint behind the door handles.

I wonder now, after hearing what Twisted came across, how many cars were illegal at our District race. One inspector began shoving one of those common store bought gap gauges between our wheels and body. We had them set at .015". I asked her not to push too hard or she would mess up the car. She told me they had to meet the rules, except, our NSC rules don't specify a gap requirement. She handed it back to my boy and told to fix them if he needed to before weighing it in. She didn't even know the rules. I do appreciate the time they volunteer and even a situation like we had with her can be a teaching moment for the boy.
 
I actually wish our Rules would require the stock wheels and axles. We groove, taper and polish them ourselves. We find the best wheels using a dial indicator.

I don't know how you would check for the use of stock axles though. When aftermarket parts are allowed you limit the ones without funds to buy them. It also encourages the idea of just how simple it is to keep clicking the option list from a supplier and end up with totally prepped wheels and axles that need no work. At least if stock parts are required it forces the adults to spend time with the boys in order to be fast.
 
davet said:
I actually wish our Rules would require the stock wheels and axles. We groove, taper and polish them ourselves. We find the best wheels using a dial indicator.

I don't know how you would check for the use of stock axles though. When aftermarket parts are allowed you limit the ones without funds to buy them. It also encourages the idea of just how simple it is to keep clicking the option list from a supplier and end up with totally prepped wheels and axles that need no work. At least if stock parts are required it forces the adults to spend time with the boys in order to be fast.

Axles only... wheels have to stay stock.. no lathing.

Last years rules said no grooving the axles... they said a lot of no's. the almost flipped out when the kids I helped had a K-house groove in the axles.
 
davet said:
You're kidding. He left and his boy didn't even get to race? How does the kid explain that Grandma and Grandpa and his friends who were excited to hear how he did.

For this Council we ran aftermarket wheels and axles for the first time. We also had our stock wheel/axle combos already pre-marked and reprepped in a box sitting in the truck. Tuning board also in case we had to swap them and re-adjust steer. I was nervous about an inspector's caliper being different than the one used to machine the wheels.
Teaching my boy the Be Prepared thing and all.
I had a mom tell me these were the wheels we ran at district they must not check there..then she had me tell her boy why the car wasn't legal.she refused to get wheels( I offered her a spare set I had for my boys) she didn't have tools ( again I offered my pliers) no ..they had no way to tune..I tried my best to help..I think it may have been bought off e- bay..never know
 
I couldn't imagine having to tell my kid we aren't going to be able to race his car because I gave him illegal wheels to use. You have some of the most progressive rules for a scout council race. I guess for some people if you give an inch they try to take a mile.

twistediron said:
I had a mom tell me these were the wheels we ran at district they must not check there..then she had me tell her boy why the car wasn't legal.she refused to get wheels( I offered her a spare set I had for my boys) she didn't have tools ( again I offered my pliers) no ..they had no way to tune..I tried my best to help..I think it may have been bought off e- bay..never know