Lets hear about how it went from those that attended. How was Inspection given their unique rule set?
PWD World Championship Post Mortem
- Thread starter ScoutRacer
- Start date
One passed and one was DQed and had to be reworked there. They said my wheels were too thin and I had to buy a crap set there. This cost us.
The guy said we needed viewing holes too but I told him his rules stated pro did not.
The other car ran six 1st and two 2nd places. We came in 3rd overall in our group but failed to advance.
The biggest issue was the starter released cars and they hit the cars from the previous heat three times in a row because staff was still removing them. I yelled at the MC to stop that stupid crap.
The guy said we needed viewing holes too but I told him his rules stated pro did not.
The other car ran six 1st and two 2nd places. We came in 3rd overall in our group but failed to advance.
The biggest issue was the starter released cars and they hit the cars from the previous heat three times in a row because staff was still removing them. I yelled at the MC to stop that stupid crap.
Hello everyone... we also attended the Ny race. My thoughts ... they need help! In my opinion they are not very strict on upholding the rules where they should! I saw multiple cars that weren’t legal and cars forced to race pro stock when they should have raced stock. The bottom line is they needed more help from trained eyes.
Our car was initially failed at inspection because the front wheels didn’t fit in the pass fail box. It took almost an hour to convince them that the car would indeed fit on the track and they finally passed it through. So after all said and done we took 3rd in the bears and placed 6th in the fast 15 with an average time of 2.998 in pro stock.
Thank you to all the pros that have helped us over the years, my son and I are so greatfull! Congrats to all the other winners, and for those that came so close don’t give up... keep trying, better luck next year! This was our third attempt at this race, keep your chin up and we’ll see yah next year.
Our car was initially failed at inspection because the front wheels didn’t fit in the pass fail box. It took almost an hour to convince them that the car would indeed fit on the track and they finally passed it through. So after all said and done we took 3rd in the bears and placed 6th in the fast 15 with an average time of 2.998 in pro stock.
Thank you to all the pros that have helped us over the years, my son and I are so greatfull! Congrats to all the other winners, and for those that came so close don’t give up... keep trying, better luck next year! This was our third attempt at this race, keep your chin up and we’ll see yah next year.
We also attended the NYC race. And they definitely need more volunteers for the inspection if only to speed it up. We had no problem with inspection but plenty of others did. Most heard complaint by us was about the 4 wheels touching rule in the stock division. Interestingly we had no problems with our axles, we had drilled canted holes and I expected them to ask me to pull an axle to prove that the axle was straight but that never happened. This years car was slightly faster than our car from last year which is quite an improvement since we were running standard BSA axles vs aftermarket axles last year and due to the drilled DFW axle hole we had slightly more steer than we usually do. We managed to make the fast 15 again, which really surprised me since this year there were a lot more sub 3.0 cars than last year. In the end we finished at a higher position than last year so we showed improvement with a car which the scout put more work in than last year and that was handicapped by the NYC rules, overall we are quite happy with that result. However although our car showed improvement, it was only minor, it will take some additional research and work to get to the ~2.94x-2.95x range that was noted by the winner (we ran around 2.99x). I know we still have room for improvement since we only ran with ~1.76 oz behind the rear axles and had a relative heavy frame with about 15.5 g on the DFW. I really hope that for next year they will allow bent axles again and maybe even allow after market axles. We can only dream of them allowing oil in the pro stock.
Looks like we must have had bad deal of the day. Where do I start.........?
First our car was flagged for not using original slots, only 3 wheels touching and wheels not to size. After showing the people we were in the "pro stock class" and everything is to those specs, they said to send it back through and they will take care of it. ( reinspection #2) Then it gets flagged again for wheel size. after explaining to them, in THEIR rules it states no less than 1.170. He replied yes and it does not meet that. I then asked him to use a micrometer.......1.174 Hmmmm, i'm no mathematician but i'm pretty sure "4" is higher than "0". They took the car in the back behind their little dividers. (reinspection #3) He came back out again and stated that they think our car has bent axles and would like the DFW axle pulled
So I pulled the axle and handed it to him. As he's holding it up and spinning it in his fingers, he says, I think its bent a little. I took the axle off of him and placed it on the table and spun it. After about 5 second of it spinning around in a circle with no wobble, I just looked at him and said, come on, your fishing at this point. Finally passed the car and we changed nothing from the very start. I'm sure I lost or gained some steering either way but was just happy to be out of the crowded check in.
During the racing, on 2 occasions, the person picking up the cars off the track didn't get them off in time and the next set of cars came crashing into them. One occasion, the cars came down and hit the tray they used to transport them. Overall, with dollars spent, check in debacle and seeing the care they gave, I was disappointed in the event. Check in was still going on after the 4th pro stock race
This is the first year we decided to make the trip. Maybe my expectations were to high only seeing what videos they put out on social media and YouTube. Definitely glad to hear others had a better time and no issues. Great job to the boys.
My son ended up 8th in bear and 32nd overall. He was happy to be in the top 10 and I kept him occupied with other things going on when we were in check in so he had a good experience.
First our car was flagged for not using original slots, only 3 wheels touching and wheels not to size. After showing the people we were in the "pro stock class" and everything is to those specs, they said to send it back through and they will take care of it. ( reinspection #2) Then it gets flagged again for wheel size. after explaining to them, in THEIR rules it states no less than 1.170. He replied yes and it does not meet that. I then asked him to use a micrometer.......1.174 Hmmmm, i'm no mathematician but i'm pretty sure "4" is higher than "0". They took the car in the back behind their little dividers. (reinspection #3) He came back out again and stated that they think our car has bent axles and would like the DFW axle pulled
So I pulled the axle and handed it to him. As he's holding it up and spinning it in his fingers, he says, I think its bent a little. I took the axle off of him and placed it on the table and spun it. After about 5 second of it spinning around in a circle with no wobble, I just looked at him and said, come on, your fishing at this point. Finally passed the car and we changed nothing from the very start. I'm sure I lost or gained some steering either way but was just happy to be out of the crowded check in.During the racing, on 2 occasions, the person picking up the cars off the track didn't get them off in time and the next set of cars came crashing into them. One occasion, the cars came down and hit the tray they used to transport them. Overall, with dollars spent, check in debacle and seeing the care they gave, I was disappointed in the event. Check in was still going on after the 4th pro stock race
This is the first year we decided to make the trip. Maybe my expectations were to high only seeing what videos they put out on social media and YouTube. Definitely glad to hear others had a better time and no issues. Great job to the boys.My son ended up 8th in bear and 32nd overall. He was happy to be in the top 10 and I kept him occupied with other things going on when we were in check in so he had a good experience.
3rd AOL and 8th overall in Pro Stock.
No Issues with inspection.
Actually enjoyed staight axles due to ease of tuning/setup.
(and FYI - in speaking to the organizers , the reasoning for
no bent axles is that competitive fully built NBA cars hard
to buy from an online vendor, which has happened in the past)
2 other boys from our same small town (of 3000 people)
came in 16th (missed fast 15 by a thou) and 24th overall.
Both boys are in the same school class as my son !!!
Enjoyed talking with Joe who used to post here.
No Issues with inspection.
Actually enjoyed staight axles due to ease of tuning/setup.
(and FYI - in speaking to the organizers , the reasoning for
no bent axles is that competitive fully built NBA cars hard
to buy from an online vendor, which has happened in the past)
2 other boys from our same small town (of 3000 people)
came in 16th (missed fast 15 by a thou) and 24th overall.
Both boys are in the same school class as my son !!!
Enjoyed talking with Joe who used to post here.
We made the trip again this year. Like most others that have commented we had to build a new car to meet the rules for the event so we decided to enter the stock class. Last year we built to the prostock rules and were luck enough to place 3rd in Webelos 1 after a number of crashes at the stop section as we were in the first group. Based on that we did not rush down to check in we waited until about 9 to get in line as we did not want to be in the first group. We were also expecting the inspection to be a challenge and it was sort of.
Weight:
Having to take weight off onsite last year (more than anticipated with tungsten puddy) we went in at 4.97 oz on our scale and did not have any issue with the weight this year.
First pass through inspection they came back with a number of items that were an issue.
Axles said they were not magnetic however they were.
Wheels said they were lightened they were not.
Said all 4 wheels were not touching but when you rolled the car on their piece of granite all four rolled. This seemed to be the biggest issue as they wanted to push us towards the prostock group but the car was not built for that. My son challenged them on their findings and the person who seemed to be in charge of the inspection came over. We politely made our case showed him that the axle slots were in the factory positions and that all 4 wheels rolled. He took the car back behind the "curtain" and after a couple of minutes came back and said that the car passed inspection for stock class.
For the racing I can not believe that the lanes were that different but his times during the normal race ranged from a low of 3.0192 to a high of 3.0923. Then in the first round of the fast 15 race it ran a 3.0086.
My son was in the Webelos 2 group placed 2nd in his rank and 3rd in the fast 15 race.
I would like to thank everyone that contributes to the forum as we have learned so much from reading the posts. I would also like to thank DerbyDad4Hire without your great speed products we would not have had the success that we have.
Weight:
Having to take weight off onsite last year (more than anticipated with tungsten puddy) we went in at 4.97 oz on our scale and did not have any issue with the weight this year.
First pass through inspection they came back with a number of items that were an issue.
Axles said they were not magnetic however they were.
Wheels said they were lightened they were not.
Said all 4 wheels were not touching but when you rolled the car on their piece of granite all four rolled. This seemed to be the biggest issue as they wanted to push us towards the prostock group but the car was not built for that. My son challenged them on their findings and the person who seemed to be in charge of the inspection came over. We politely made our case showed him that the axle slots were in the factory positions and that all 4 wheels rolled. He took the car back behind the "curtain" and after a couple of minutes came back and said that the car passed inspection for stock class.
For the racing I can not believe that the lanes were that different but his times during the normal race ranged from a low of 3.0192 to a high of 3.0923. Then in the first round of the fast 15 race it ran a 3.0086.
My son was in the Webelos 2 group placed 2nd in his rank and 3rd in the fast 15 race.
I would like to thank everyone that contributes to the forum as we have learned so much from reading the posts. I would also like to thank DerbyDad4Hire without your great speed products we would not have had the success that we have.
Not wanting to start a flame war, but why are are inspected behind a curtain? I read that from several participants. Seems odd that you could not witness the inspection as it is taking place.
Yeah, that wouldn't fly with me. No problem with going to the head of the inspections or whatever, but it's going to be in front of the competitors.
Sounds like they have an idiot that is either in charge of, or has way too much influence on the rules...and then their actual check-in people don't all know what they're looking at.
When we went in 2016, the dude there that inspected my son's car knew just enough to be dangerous. He first put a magnet to our DD4H axles and said "they're nickel, that's not legal". This was a Pro Stock entry, where the rules specifically stated that "you may or may not choose to use the axles from the kit".
So no, they're actually stainless steel, and yes the most certainly are legal.
Then he notices we're from NC and asked me if I knew Dale...whatever Spacewalker's last name is. I don't know Spacewalker, but I've seen/heard his name around the forums and that name sounded familiar. I finally put it together and asked if he meant Spacewalker and that was it. Apparently he lived near him for awhile or something. So he was our buddy after that, but like I said, he knew just enough but evidently didn't know all the rules and that was their "ace" inspector.
That's why they should relax the rules instead of making them stricter. You already don't have super-knowledgeable folks doing the check-in to begin with. Why make their jobs harder? Especially for Pro Stock? What's "pro" about Pro Stock if the only difference is wheelbase and a lifted wheel?
Such a great opportunity to make this hobby and Scouting in general look great, and they turn it into a cluster.
Not to mention...........Stock axles are almost never straight. lol. Good job calling him out. He was definitely fishing. I wonder who was behind the curtain doing inspection that didn't want to be seen. (Just a thought)Looks like we must have had bad deal of the day. Where do I start.........?
First our car was flagged for not using original slots, only 3 wheels touching and wheels not to size. After showing the people we were in the "pro stock class" and everything is to those specs, they said to send it back through and they will take care of it. ( reinspection #2) Then it gets flagged again for wheel size. after explaining to them, in THEIR rules it states no less than 1.170. He replied yes and it does not meet that. I then asked him to use a micrometer.......1.174 Hmmmm, i'm no mathematician but i'm pretty sure "4" is higher than "0". They took the car in the back behind their little dividers. (reinspection #3) He came back out again and stated that they think our car has bent axles and would like the DFW axle pulled
During the racing, on 2 occasions, the person picking up the cars off the track didn't get them off in time and the next set of cars came crashing into them. One occasion, the cars came down and hit the tray they used to transport them. Overall, with dollars spent, check in debacle and seeing the care they gave, I was disappointed in the event. Check in was still going on after the 4th pro stock race
My son ended up 8th in bear and 32nd overall. He was happy to be in the top 10 and I kept him occupied with other things going on when we were in check in so he had a good experience.
They just had a number of inspection stations setup on the other side of some partitions. If you walked to the end of the inspection area you could watch them inspect the cars. I was expecting to have to remove one of the axles as we had slots to help with the install and and removal if needed. Had wanted to glue the axles as we knew they would be handled rough but did not want to take the chance.
Last year with no partitions, dads were going over to the inspection
area and shouting at the inspectors (telling them what to look for).
I saw it multiple times.
This year they solved that problem with the partitions, but you could still see
what was going on, if were that troubled by the process.
They got 330+ cars inspected.
We had no issues because we were prepared.
Others it seems were not.
I loaned some of my tools to guys who traveled from afar and had
what I would consider, basic issues that did not meet specs.
One car was 7.125 inches and the guy came from Ohio.
Another car had 1.168 wheels on the front.
That does not happen by accident.
Would you not measure/check everything before you traveled?
I know I did.
This was my son's (and hence my) first trip to the event. My son's car registered in stock and went through inspections quickly. Although I imagine that YMMV depending on your particular inspector. The waiting area for the inspection stations was jam packed and could have benefitted from more space &/or a general estimate of when to return to talk to your inspector.
Like petelhughes I lent my toolkit to dads whose sons' cars were flagged. I helped one dad who wasn't familiar with how to dissemble and reassemble his son's wheels and axles.
I also noticed that the inspectors were strict on the use of US-made BSA wheels, as it seemed like a fair number of cars were flagged for using Chinese ones.
Random notes:
- My whole family was happy that the race was indoors, as it was brutally hot and humid that day.
- The kids were bored with the waiting, but at least there were other kids' activities available including legos and another track. Overall my kids had fun, but my daughter said she would have preferred the beach.
I'd also like to thank DD4H for his products and this forum for the wealth of information here.
Like petelhughes I lent my toolkit to dads whose sons' cars were flagged. I helped one dad who wasn't familiar with how to dissemble and reassemble his son's wheels and axles.
I also noticed that the inspectors were strict on the use of US-made BSA wheels, as it seemed like a fair number of cars were flagged for using Chinese ones.
Random notes:
- My whole family was happy that the race was indoors, as it was brutally hot and humid that day.
- The kids were bored with the waiting, but at least there were other kids' activities available including legos and another track. Overall my kids had fun, but my daughter said she would have preferred the beach.
I'd also like to thank DD4H for his products and this forum for the wealth of information here.
I know it's an older post but as an inspector life's a B****. I have mere seconds to inspect what they have had weeks to months to build. I have the rules I check highlighted and right there in front of me for each class. I have gage blocks set to the min tire size, two digital calipers, a magnet on a rod, certified 5 oz weight and scale, Tiny square, bright light, my machinist visor and a go no-go clearance box. I have walked more than a few cars in question over to the track to verify they would not have clearance problems. Certain things catch my eye . If you know to mark the axle head or the tire is on the bare minimum for size, or run a ladder car or a paint job that Rembrandt would be proud of, I feel you should expect extra care in the inspection. You went the extra mile and so should I. We have the same info on what tire sizes to expect from the box. If I find an infraction I quietly ask them if they can correct it. No scene. If they don't want to they get bumped up to the open class. I still say I've never had a boy that tried to push beyond the rules. Cars come in so fast I get no breaks or lunch. I seldom even see a race until the end. Is it worth it? YES. I get to see some of the coolest cars anyone can imagine. BW The Evil One.
P.S. I love how some cars somehow get heavier after their rank race and before the King of the Hill finals. lol
P.S. I love how some cars somehow get heavier after their rank race and before the King of the Hill finals. lol
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